tg are rascist?

[sdheed707]

Don't get me wrong, TGs are racist - EVERYhuman being is racist, it's a fundamental human trait to mistrust that which is unfamiliar.

That sentence was spot on

 

[irishscott99]

Does the word 'racist' exist in the Thai language?

 

[woofs n whiskers]

Steve,
I find it interesting that you are appalled when a TG says something racist but when an educated man like Frode vitually confirms an urban myth( like all black men have big d1cks) you let it slide. To me both comments were racist, so what is the difference?

 

[Lozza]

Well hey I'll land in BKK Airport at 2:30pm Nov.1 so maybe you can Show me the Nana Plaza I planned on staying in Pattaya the Whole time but ill comit a Week to Phuket so I can go to MTB

Armand/JayBee - When are you guys going ?

 

[The Wise One]

Sorry to go so far back but I want to answer all points raised.

Bigot: a person who is intolerant, esp of race or religion (Collins Dictionary)

I don't give a rat's ass who's pecker is the biggest and what the 'urban myths' happen to be. To my simple mind that is not bigotry so does not meet the criteria for me.

 

[E-Man]

BTW.....I am not singling the US out here......it is just that they are the biggest and easiest target..........

In my countries Australia and New Zealand......I am a citizen of both......there have been appalling atrocities committed against the Aboriginal peoples...so much so that it is a wonder that these ethnicities have managed to survive..
In Australia the first settlers fought with guns against stick spears and poisonned their water holes and in NZ the Maori were a bit more advanced and fearless...but the odds were stacked against them.....at least they came out of it with a treaty/hmmmmmm.....piece of paper.....

These sorts of backgrounds are I am afraid to say common in many countries backgrounds......it is how we deal with them today that will actually make a difference for the future......and how our generation will be judged in history

 

[richardinunion]

Well I have come to believe that there are at least 3 basic fundamentalist groups that break down the walls of racism: ALCOHOLICS, DRUG ADDICTS, and HEDONIST (SEX-TOURIST). 555555555555555555

 

[Coconut Guy]

I think pretty much all of the posts here have been well reasoned and thought out, mine included.

I may well be naive and maybe I should get out more. But I think many people here may have taken me wrong, I'm not naive enough to believe that I can fix the world or that these things don't go on.

My definitions of bigotry would involve all sorts of religous hatred and the way women are treated in lots of places.

If somebody in my immediate surroundings were to physically attack a woman I hope that I would have the balls to intervene. In much the same way, when Frode posted his wife's comments last night I reacted as I hope I would if they were said in my company.

The point that many seem to have missed is that I was as much offended that Frode would post such things as the fact that his wife would say them. Frode was good enough to answer the points I raised and I have absolutely no wish to go back and drag that up.

I do take on board that many of those who have posted since are glad that he did that and believe that it helps us understand these things a little more. I just happen to disagree, and as much as Frode (and everybody else) is entitled to their say then so am I.

I brought a Thai girl to England, so have some idea of what the realism of prejudice is. I've experienced it first hand and it just makes me sad, and I don't just mean bargirls bagging on black guys, I mean bigotry and prejudice of all sorts.

I took my son on a trip once, he was about 7 years old and we were going on a steam train in Cumbria. Typically England, it was pi55ing down and there was a lady on the platform in a wheelchair. She had to sit and wait in the rain until everyone else was on the train, then the cunt running the show helped her onto the train and put her in the guards van, which meant the lady helping her had to stand up. It was heartbreaking.

What would it have cost to sort her out first instead of last? Absolutely nothing. What would it have cost Frode to put a little more consideration into what he posted last night? About the same.

When I see these situations now it either makes me mad or it makes me sad. As I see more of the world I understand just how deeply rooted prejudice of all forms is, but just because I undersatnd it does not make it right. And when I see it I'm going to say so, and when I see it here on this board then you can bet your ass I'm going to react.

Paddy, Tyfon; I can see that you guys think I will get over this if I will just be as well travelled and as wordly-wise as yourselves, but I won't.

 

[Laurie]

I land in BKK the last week of September through that first week of October. It seems that we will all miss each other by a couple days. Sorry Man!

 

[Nick Nuemann]

1st, no slag n1

i love public enemy, grew up on that stuff, which if i may presume, you were drinking in some clubs while i was popping acne while listening to chuck d and flav

i personally love your mr maggoo glasses and your style

as far as your business, after seeing that majestic palace you designed for yourself, all you'll here from me when it comes to your business acumen is applause

as far as any reference to pretentiousness regarding your jaunts to milan, if i am guily of that it would only be out of jealousy

 

[Juu]

I agree with you, I hate hip hop, and I hate even more when girls ask me to dance to that sh§t.
But some of those hip hop girls have nice a§§es.

F

 

[gesura]

They do without doubt control the money.. Look at the bankers.. Look at the merchant banks.. Rothschilds, Getties, etc...

Fair play to them, my hats off, hard work, close families, perferential treatment within thier communities, some cultures could learn a lot about how to succeed as an immigrant etc from that. Of course it depends on your view of usuery and debt though..

I heard the other day that the chinese are the jews of the east.. When I was discussing this with the guy he opened my eyes a to a few things.. Look at the gold shops, look at the money lenders, even the very 5 for 4 system used here is known as the 'chinese system'.. The japanese kind of came out and bought a lot of stuff when they were booming but the chinese have infiltrated from the ground up.. Thailand is owned lock stock and barrel by Chinese Thais, they have taken over, every media person is white skinned Chinese Thai.. Thaksin etc..

 

[devy]

i suggest you see dave chapelle's Block Party, all those type of artists were in it

 

[Prianka]

I liked the wording of the term *system*. Contrary to popular belief, being the figure head of any political organization does not guarantee that you are in charge of it. Politicians change......constantly...... and it is the knowledge of that change that makes it obvious that are much much stronger players on the field. And this can be said with *any* country. Because most people that know within themselves the level of their strength do not need the acknowledgement of others, through said titles, to be assured that they are in charge.

And as for the economical systems in play... this is merely doing what history has always done......change. Every great super has fallen. From the Romans to the Vikings to the Japanese and soon to the US itself. I am not jaded by this idea of one country stays number 1 forever. So to talk about the asian countries improving and coming about..........all we really are saying is history is coming full circle and the rotation is starting over again... this is not a fact it is just IMHO.

 

[joewillgo]

would that be the sa with tats all over her back and pretty much everywhere else. that girl is a lunatic, though last visit she was more mellow had some bloke taking care of her

 

[Sean :)]

Well no matter what, peoples pre-judging mentality will not stop me from going to LOS. Heck you can find that mentality anywhere. As long as I can find that one rose in the thorn bush every trip, I will continually go back over and over again.

As as for feeling sorry for myself that I may not have my choice with every woman I see.......hey thats life. I did not just start traveling overseas and am not a naive to the sweet necter that is a woman. I have had my fair share probably more than most(and I am not talking P4P scene) and when it really comes down to it, you still have to ask yourself.......... DID YOU ENJOY YOURSELF? As for me, I had a wonderful time there and taking time out now from the looking glass, I can say that it isn't the 15-18(depends on who was keepign score,:blah: ) women I *knew* my first 4 days on vacation that I remember the most, it is the last part of it.....with one girl enjoying the beauties of Thailand.

 

[p055umcub3r]

Oh, and I'm due in the pub; Steve@thaib out.

 

[Zeb]

A slight rise in the temperature in the last few posts, let's take a step back and look at things coolly.

Frode reported what one particular TG said to him, with the qualification that she had limited education. Some very educated people though, in many nations, hold equally unpleasant views. Her assertion that the black players on the TV must smell is clearly prejudiced, because, unless you have smell-o-vision, there is no way of knowing. The girl's other comments reflect the the limited contact that she and her friends will have had with blacks and the fear that unfamiliarity instills. She will have had the same reaction, probably, to seeing her first Farang (white Westerner) after leaving the farm, but will have overcome it rapidly because they became her main source of income and very common in her new working environment. The fear rapidly dissolves into familiarity, which in some cases - as we all know - breeds contempt, yielding the cynical, take-them-for-every-Baht type of BG.

Returning to the smell issue. We have heard soooooo often on this forum that TGs think Farangs smell. They don't really smell more, just different. The sense of smell, like all senses, is subject to habituation - a continuous stimulus eventually ceases to register. You don't notice the touch of your clothes shortly after dressing, your chewing gum loses it's flavour faster than chemical assays say the flavour molecules decline and, if you kick off your shoes you'll rapidly habituate to the smell, but anyone entering the room for the first time will soon let you know about it. So we become accustomed to the smell of our regular companions and when we encounter someone with, say, a radically different diet or body chemistry, then we notice their smell. It has been said that TGs have commented that their LT Farangs smell less after a few weeks on Thai food, but even those who persist on a Western diet are sufficiently familiar to their TGs who are both habituated to Farang smells and motivated to overlook them. Again this is not the case with the minority populations of blacks, Arabs, Indians, etc. amongst the mongering populace. As these groups discover LOS and increase in numbers, bringing more money, then they too will be accepted with open arms (amongst other limbs).

Steve's reaction to Frode's report give me two causes for concern: Firstly, to confront people head-on over such deeply ingrained social conditioning is seldom the most productive way of changing their opinion. They will often just take up the defensive and cling to their views, albethey second-hand ("Girls in the bar say they [smell]..."), all the more strongly. And remember, Frode has to live with her: Constant criticism will just lead to resentment and undermine the relationship. Far better to introduce her gradually to positive role-models and representatives of other cultures and let her change her views herself through her own experience.

Secondly, to criticise Frode for sharing the experience - which he doesn't condone or try to excuse beyond the quite reasonably pointing out the girl's limited education and contact with other cultures - is rather naive. It's unlikely that anyone reading Frode's original posting would interpret it as condoning the girl's view, view but reporting it, in context, is a valuable addition to this discussion, informing us on the roots of the prejudices these girls possess (like all social groups in all societies, remember) and how they are passed amongst them by word of mouth, not necessarily by first-hand experience.

I have spent a lot of time studying the rise of Nazism, it's origins and the social and political conditions that allowed it to flourish. I'm not prepared to look away from these dark characters and dismiss them as aberrations, monsters and lunatics. These were human beings and they reacted to, and where conditioned by, their times to allow a minority to lead - and the majority to follow - a misguided and disastrous creed. To fail to study and publicly discuss these matters is to leave the world ill-prepared to recognize and avert the same thing happening again. In the same way, a frank exchange of reports on BG attitudes - providing it is recognised that they are individual cases and that the authors themselves are subject to prejudice and generalization - should help BMs in recognising the roots of a TG's attitudes and, through a better understanding, change or, indeed, allow oneself to be changed by them.

Armand has already said he learned to speak up and advertise that he is American to dispel some of the prejudice his colour stirs in bars, and I will, for entirely selfish reasons, take to a Thai diet for a good two weeks before arrival to reduce my Farang odour.

 

[jlde2001]

Not trying to pick a fight with you here Armand but when you say you did it for the Iraqi people....not the rich and powerful....did you join the forces to go to Iraq particularly......if not did you have a choice in being deployed to there....and did your buddies???

Did you have a strong opinion before you went and was it changed over there and perhaps even when you got back again......

These are not rhetorical questions nor are they meant to be offensive....I am just really interested in the answers if you wish to share them.......

 

[Charles]

Good post armand..

I often find its very difficult to mention specific groups (EG jews / Chinese / etc) holding or having power without sounding racist or anti semetic.. I dont believe I am either but I do see myself as a realist.. I do think some communities have traits that make them more likely to strive for wealth or power (compare Chinese against Thais.. Compare Austrailians to Jewish people) while others seem more disposed as a community to value leisure or fun over wealth and power. Sweeping generalizations of course but a kernal of truth in many of these points.